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The TJT
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Post by The TJT » Tue Oct 26, 2004 8:19 pm

Ummm....that is if you give 10-7-5 scoring for top 3 positions in the end of the week. I don't remember right now how the scoring is/was?

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Post by LN2 » Tue Oct 26, 2004 8:27 pm

nah, don't get me wrong.....overall I like the system.

I just think it has way too much weight...potentially really weighing a couple of games a master perhaps is participating in...to the point even showing his techniques on the first day likely won't be beaten.

...so he ends up with 16 points.

...while the following week you end up with a similar masterful performance but perhaps they couldn't play the first few days...so submitted it the 5th or 6th day that week.

Their equally impressive performance only gets 11 or 12 points...compared to the 16 the other guy got last week.

Get a couple 16s and odds are no one will be able to touch your point total.

ie. 2x16 = 32 3x10 = 30 so someone with 3 wins will still be shy of someone with only 2 wins...even though they are impressive wins the 3 wins player should end up with more points.

at most that should be something like 2x14 = 28 vs 3x10=30...so most wins still has guarantee of most points from those wins.

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Post by destructor » Tue Oct 26, 2004 8:29 pm

The TJT wrote:
destructor wrote:
If player1 hide score until last seconds and he win in last day and player 2 show all tactics from first day and he has 1st in each day (from 1 to 6) then:

system 1:
- player2 score = 6
- player1 score =10
You forget that if player 2 finishes second at the end of the week, he gets 7 points more...
system 1:
- player2 score = 13
- player1 score =10

:wink:
No, I don't forget. I count max points in 6 days for player2 and minimum in last day. I count that player2 will get 0 points in last day because player1, player3, ... playern beat his score :wink:

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The TJT
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Post by The TJT » Tue Oct 26, 2004 8:34 pm

destructor wrote: No, I don't forget. I count max points in 6 days for player2 and minimum in last day. I count that player2 will get 0 points in last day because player1, player3, ... playern beat his score :wink:
Ah...poor player 2 :o

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Post by destructor » Tue Oct 26, 2004 8:39 pm

LN2 wrote:nah, don't get me wrong.....overall I like the system.

I just think it has way too much weight...potentially really weighing a couple of games a master perhaps is participating in...to the point even showing his techniques on the first day likely won't be beaten.

...so he ends up with 16 points.

...while the following week you end up with a similar masterful performance but perhaps they couldn't play the first few days...so submitted it the 5th or 6th day that week.

Their equally impressive performance only gets 11 or 12 points...compared to the 16 the other guy got last week.

Get a couple 16s and odds are no one will be able to touch your point total.

ie. 2x16 = 32 3x10 = 30 so someone with 3 wins will still be shy of someone with only 2 wins...even though they are impressive wins the 3 wins player should end up with more points.

at most that should be something like 2x14 = 28 vs 3x10=30...so most wins still has guarantee of most points from those wins.
This is bonus for no hiding tactics. Player show all tactics and take risks that can easy lose in last days because some players only wait as griffons to see, choose and use best tactics.

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Post by destructor » Tue Oct 26, 2004 8:43 pm

The TJT wrote:
destructor wrote: No, I don't forget. I count max points in 6 days for player2 and minimum in last day. I count that player2 will get 0 points in last day because player1, player3, ... playern beat his score :wink:
Ah...poor player 2 :o
No poor, other griffons beat his score.

But back to system1 and player2 on second position in last day:
-player2 13points
-player1 10points
I think this is OK. Player1 is griffon only and can't get more points than player2 :D

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Post by The TJT » Tue Oct 26, 2004 8:49 pm

My dictionary tells that "griffon" is a dog.
...A dog that hides it's bones maybe? :)

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Post by destructor » Tue Oct 26, 2004 9:00 pm

I can't find my hand-dictionary and use stupid dictionary installed on my PC. Second meaning is 'vulture'. Bird, not dog :D

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Post by Phil Lamat » Tue Oct 26, 2004 9:03 pm

Well ;
I like your ideas , but 1 point per day is too much ; maybe 1 point for day 2-4-6 is cooler

I've announced 1st game, but now I'm leaving 4 days with children ;
can someone launch a poll for me ?
1-no bonus pts
2-my first idea
3-1 bonus pt per day
4-1 bonus point every 2 days
5-others ??

if 3 or 4, who will check ?
I'm sleeping at 0:00 gmt, and if someone upload before I check ?

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Post by The TJT » Tue Oct 26, 2004 9:07 pm

destructor wrote:I can't find my hand-dictionary and use stupid dictionary installed on my PC. Second meaning is 'vulture'. Bird, not dog :D
I should have known that! :oops:

http://marp.retrogames.com/index.cgi?mo ... t=^griffon

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Post by wuzel » Wed Oct 27, 2004 2:12 am

okey okey
lets end this point discussion and start playing :)
coz we here to play right? and have fun right?
so where is te first game?
It's good 2 be here with U guys :)

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Post by destructor » Wed Oct 27, 2004 5:41 am

wuzel wrote:so where is te first game?
Here:
viewtopic.php?t=11828
:)

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Post by Ian Sutton » Wed Oct 27, 2004 6:25 am

I just wanted to propose another method to prevent last minute submissions and promote competition.

When a top score is submitted, others will always have some minimum amount of time to respond. Perhaps 4 days from time of that submission. So for example if a top score is submitted on the last minute of the last day, the competition for that game is extended for 4 days from that time. First day submissions would not extend the time period because there is enough time left for people to riposte.

It should eliminate all such maneuvering and allow everyone a fair shot. Anyway that's just a suggestion.

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Post by LN2 » Wed Oct 27, 2004 11:49 am

yes, just perhaps bonus points for the last 2-3 days before the deadline.

...with a max bonus of perhaps 3 points if someone had submitted a first place score 3+ days before the deadline that holds up.

Face it...the issue was with holding out submissions until the last couple of hours. A submission 2-3 days in advance is every bit as good as one submitted 6 days in advance.

There are still many cases though where if the person thinks if their competition viewing their replay would increase their chances of then getting beat, they would still wait until the last couple of hours before submitting.

If they submitted a couple days earlier, then that other player could beat their score...and wait until the last hour to submit since it might only mean 1 point bonus anyway...I'll give up that 1 point to avoid losing a potential 3+ points.

It's not a solution at all for those types of cases. It all depends on the game used there.

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Discouraging last minute submissions

Post by Zhorik » Wed Oct 27, 2004 2:20 pm

Another approach to try and discourage last minute submissions is to have a random element in the cutoff time. The idea would be to have a random cutoff time somewhere between, for example, the 5th and 8th day. It isn't practical to hold onto INPs for long, since you risk getting cutoff without notice.

A clear drawback is that you can get screwed by missing the cutoff without notice just as you finish a great game. You also need to constantly monitor cutoff status at MARP to avoid wasting time playing after the cutoff.

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