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Circus Charlie consider a limited Life rule ?

Posted: Tue Aug 11, 2015 5:12 pm
by KIG666
Watched some INP's today and was really surprised to see that not a single person would have reached the 999,990 max score without all the free lives bugs 8O
The lion fire ring free life bug is already super cheap clear cheating but in combination with those mega free lives bugs that occur at 930 and 980 just super lame to say it nice :x

Would it be not better for a game like Circus Charlie to limit the lives to let's say at least 15 ?
15 lives as special rule to determine the best players for this game sounds fair enough no ?
Even the default free life settings at 20k and every 70 would only allow you bonus lives at 20 90 160 230 300 370 440 510 580 650 720 790 860 930 so 15 would be perfect and pretty fair :D

If you can't reach the 999,990 with 15 lives it's clear to say that the bugs were the only reason for the max out therefore you should not be rewarded with a 1st place for cheating on a title that you haven't mastered yet :wink:

Limited lives would also fix this annoying 1st place problem and who knows maybe even motivate some ppl again to play the game without those lame bugs.

What do others think of this idea?

Edit: Almost forgot to mention that I want this change just for one set best would be Circus Charlie (Centuri)(circuscc) since TG tracks set 1 the konami version.
I noticed that all ppl with 1st place scores on circus charlie have maxed out scores on the other romsets as well so to add a special rule just to circuscc would be ideal since that way it would not even affect so called historical scores :)

Re: Circus Charlie consider a limited Life rule ?

Posted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 7:08 am
by edusword
In my opinion exploit a bug is not cheating... It's very different!

Re: Circus Charlie consider a limited Life rule ?

Posted: Wed Aug 12, 2015 7:32 am
by KIG666
The free life bugs in circus charlie are not really exploits since you get rewarded with tons of free lives at 930 and 980k as well without even doing anyting.
The lion fire ring reverse jump to earn extra lives yes that's an exploit but ppl on marp didn't use it for point pressing they just abused it to earn more extra lives.

In fact the inputs I watched so far show not even a single jump backwards to the ring the ppl just jump 2 times without joystick movements at the start before the first ring appears and also get the extra life pretty lame if you ask me :roll:

Just watch the circus charlie inp of MORENO@TeamBrazil the guy loses so much lives at the easy monkey stages that he must switch back to lions to make a few extra lives before he can continue with the monkeys :lol:

Exploits are cool in general if used to add points to your highscore and if they add at least a bit risk to your gameplay but just cheap extra life bugs hmm don't know the no shoot trick in galaga is also banned so is the leeching in time pilot so circus charie should really be played with the default free life settings from the programmers so 15 lives are more than enough for the game.

Circus charlie has this crappy counter stop problem you can't get past 999990 no matter how long you continue that's why a limited life rule would make sense that way the scoreboard would at least show the best players on 1st place again.
Such lame free life bugs are the main reason why ppl have not started to learn the game proper that's why I asked for a limited life rule.

The fact that so many ppl maxed out the game only shows that it's waaaay too easy with those lame free life bugs.
I for my part would really like to see a special rule added for circuscc level select romset :D

Re: Circus Charlie consider a limited Life rule ?

Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2015 3:42 pm
by The TJT
Sounds to me that there should be a rule such as "only 4 men allowed"...

The only question is how many lives? 3, 4, 5?

15 lives... nope. That's just too much... you don't get that many lives on other games either. Circus Charlie is not THAT hard. It's not like one couldn't get past some stage without losing any lives.

Re: Circus Charlie consider a limited Life rule ?

Posted: Thu Aug 13, 2015 6:45 pm
by KIG666
I would have asked for a 5 life only rule.
After I watched the circus charlie INP's on marp I was not sure if 5 would be enough for an ok score for most of the players here :lol:

I'm all for a 5 life track on hardest settings to get some competition back on this game. 5 lives isn't much if you don't play save and for maxed out points.
Anyway hope some ppl here think the same and we can get such a track in the near future, would be great :D

Re: Circus Charlie consider a limited Life rule ?

Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2015 9:28 am
by KIG666
No love for Circus Charlie here on Marp ? :( :( :(
It seems to me that CC really needs a more challenging 5 life track to change that :lol:
Since The TJT was the only one that agreed to a limited life track so far it's time to try something else.

That is what I found here on Marp and on tg posted about CC and this subject.
Chad wrote:speaking of circus charlie 999,999 is certainly an amazing score and not many people will be able to do it but it's possible to "attempt" to eliminate the score maxing out. Maybe a 3/5 life limit with no extras OR more apropriately only allow a certain number of rounds (those vine swinging rounds seems to have no limit)
zylquin wrote:Overall, the game is not designed well for competitions. Too many places available for "gray-area" leeching.
I think the only way to make it competitive for the future would be to limit the game to x number of men.
QRS1 wrote: 02-15-2005, 05:50 PM
My suggestion is 5 men, hardest settings to be added as an option. The original option to play a full game should of course be left as it is.
QRS1 wrote: 02-16-2005, 01:47 PM
Have you talked with Neil about this btw Robert? So far I have only seen my comments as a circus charlie \"master\" :)
Ok, on to my own thoughts...
First of all, I made a mistake. In deca 2002 we only TALKED about a 5men game. We played a full game on slightly harder settings, no level select and NO leechin. I remember that JD was very hard on that.. as he DQ my own recordings a few times hehe.

Anyway, the harder the settings are the more points you can score actually. You will only notice that on the horse amd bounce stages though... Don't take me wrong though... it IS harder too :)

Judging from that I see no reason to set anything else than hardest settings. The only real difference (if I remember correctly) is that (example) stage 1 horse stage on hardest is like stage stage 2 horsestage on hard and stage 3 on medium etc.

It will separate the men from the boys :)

After all I have maxed out all the clones at marp using these settings. These are full games and not 5 men but on the hardest settings. Hence why I don't think it is too hard as a category.

I still would like to hear from at least one more circus charlie master first though.
Long time since I talked with Neil. Do you have any contact with him Robert? If so, please show him this thread!
nrc wrote:(zylquin)Neil Chapman
08-12-2005, 03:24 PM
Wow, that was a lot of reading. I'm very sorry to post to this thread again as it is likely a distant memory to most.
My take on Circus Charlie is that a person will likely spend until the end of time trying to decide how you could fairly referee this game. There are too many \"gray areas\" that may or may not be interpreted as leeching.
Even if you limit it to a certain number of Charlies, you have to deal with what is and isn't leeching on the lion boards.

When I maxed out the score at Funspot, it was a legitimate game without leeching. I admit when Circus Charlie showed up in the Deca later on I was tired of the game and I leeched like hell on the Lion boards and still couldn't max out the score. QRS in turn schooled me and legitimately maxed out the score in the Deca.

The horse boards are fun to play and could really be a game all to their own. The infuriating trapeze boards require a lot of skill as well and there's really no room for leeching there either. As for the other disciplines, pretty mindless stuff really.

Yes, it takes a ton of practice and varying degrees of skill to max out the score. If you've done it, great, move on to the next game. :) p.s. And Mr. QRS, it is I who wish to be in your league!

If QRS or zylquin would be still active here I'm pretty sure they would be also for a more challenging track.
Edit : QRS plays in T14 I just noticed that a few min ago haha maybe he can post here would really like to know his opinion about this subject again.

I do agree with zylquin about the horse boards and the flying trapetze boards really the most fun and difficult events of the whole game.
The Horseback boards are the most fun part no doubt they require lots of practice the trapetze boards are also hard especially if you go for maxed out points for this event not just save swinging till the goal.

Although i do not agree with all of his viewpoints here (especially about leeching) still he shares the same opinion about limited lives.
Anyway would be great to hear some opinions from other ppl as well since I for my part would really love to have a 5 life track for Circus Charlie :D

Re: Circus Charlie consider a limited Life rule ?

Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2015 9:46 am
by QRS
I have no objection for a 5 men only category for circus charlie.

It was a very long time since I played the game (Or other games too btw!!) so I only have a vague memory of the lion stage leeching. But I do remember that JD was hard on the leeching part in the deca. I think I did max out the score without leeching? Not sure.

Circus Charlie is not that easy to max out actually. Not the hardest game in the world of course but it takes time and a lot of patience to remember everything and execute it well. But still, I'm for a 5 men rule, no problems with me there!

Not much more to add as it was like 10 years since I touched the game. Still love it tough!

Re: Circus Charlie consider a limited Life rule ?

Posted: Tue Nov 10, 2015 10:22 am
by KIG666
10 Years without playing CC understandable that you have just vague memories about the lion stage leeching :lol:
But you are still for a 5 men rule after such a long time and that's all I wanted to hear :D

I think the leeching problem would be fixed with a 5 life limit since you cannot play full risk with only 5 men.
The game is actually harder with leeching at least for me :lol:

Circus Charlie for me is all about point pressing take the lion boards as example pretty pointless and lame without leeching.
If you play for a maxed out lion event (330k+) you need to leech like hell and then even the simple lion boards can become really challenging again and that is what CC is all about :D

The ball walk boards are lame but the lion was always cool in my book lol

The horseback and trapetze boards are my favs since they are the hardest boards to master but still a maxed out lion is also not that easy like many ppl think.
Athough to get 5 perfect horesback boards or one 100% maxed out trapetze board (112K) is of course 1000 times harder.

Anyway great to hear that you are still for limited lives :D

Re: Circus Charlie consider a limited Life rule ?

Posted: Tue Nov 24, 2015 4:52 pm
by KIG666
Topic Title -----> **Circus Charlie consider a limited Life rule ?** no-one else besides QRS and The TJT with an opinion ?

Would still like to read something from a few more marpers :D
Shame that zylquin is not longer active here cause I would also like to know his opinion about advanced leeching in Circus Charlie.

IMO advanced leeching is actually the only tricky and fun part of the game.
Point pressing that's what Circus Charlie is all about and that's why we need a new track for the game lol

Here a little example video of advanced point pressing on the first trapeze board.

Not a maxed out board cause I skipped 3 really risky to perform 5k jumps since the ropes burn down pretty fast + I have not leeched the first rope.

Still a good example to show the possibilities and how difficult the game can become if played at full risk for maxed out point.
Basically 11 boards are enough to max out the score ( 5 maxed out Horse back boards (580K) + 5 lions 330K+ 1 trapeze board)

The game has even a killscreen if someone is willing to play the trapeze boards until the invisible ropes bug (killscreen) appears.
Unfortunately the score counter freezes at 999.990 if the counter would not stop we would not even need a limited life rule :roll:

Anyway I for my part would really love to see a limited life track for Circus Charlie the game reeally deserves a better track :D

Re: Circus Charlie consider a limited Life rule ?

Posted: Tue Nov 24, 2015 5:39 pm
by giro-X
I would suggest an extra score for lives left. Like, 1M per life left when reaching counterstop. This would lead competition to higher levels, otherwise, if you impose a 5 lives only, one that claims counterstop with 3 or less lives used may get the same consideration as one that claims it with 5 lives.
But I'm just one in the crowd :) there are so many games that can be counterstopped and they are without special rules.

Re: Circus Charlie consider a limited Life rule ?

Posted: Wed Nov 25, 2015 12:38 pm
by KIG666
Thanks for posting giro-X :D

I kinda like the idea with the extra points for the unused lives never thought about this option before.
After thinking some more I am now completely convinced that your points idea a bit modified in combination with limited lives is the way to go lol

I would suggest a 5 life limit now in combination with a point subtraction rule of lets say 80k for every lost life.

That way you could only max out with a really good run even if you lose only 3 lives you would already have a hard time to reach the counterstop.
I would really love to see something like that on the centuri Circus Charlie romset would be for sure a really challenging track. 8)

Re: Circus Charlie consider a limited Life rule ?

Posted: Wed Nov 25, 2015 12:51 pm
by OMG Kreygasm
KIG666 wrote: Here a little example video of advanced point pressing on the first trapeze board.
Wow. that's impressive!

Re: Circus Charlie consider a limited Life rule ?

Posted: Thu Nov 26, 2015 12:41 pm
by Zhorik
OMG Kreygasm wrote:
KIG666 wrote: Here a little example video of advanced point pressing on the first trapeze board.
Wow. that's impressive!
Indeed, damn impressive. I'd love to see some more advanced point pressing techniques on the game!

Re: Circus Charlie consider a limited Life rule ?

Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 4:08 pm
by KIG666
Must record inputs tomorrow and post some vids here :D

The Tight rope (monkey boards) are great as well cause every backjump rewards you with a 5k bonus.
With enough paractice you can do a lot of those jumps.
Lion boards are also great they might be easier than trapeze or horseback boards but to score a total of 330K without dying is also not that easy.

The Ball walk boards are really lame so far I could not find a way to jump a big combo there so no 5K bonus I guess.
Trampoline boards lame as well patternable and no possibility for advanced point pressing.

I agree with zylquin The horse boards are fun to play and could really be a game all to their own I'm sure QRS thinks similar :D
Trapeze boards are also pretty challenging those 2 events alone could be tracked as single events imo :lol:

Re: Circus Charlie consider a limited Life rule ?

Posted: Fri Nov 27, 2015 5:54 pm
by QRS
I remember JD DQ my recordings when I tried that back in a deca hehe. You have really mastered it though. Hats off! It is NOT as easy as it looks ;)