All right, here's the vote. These games/techniques are in addition to the ones listed at the RULES/BANNED TECHNIQUES/BANNED GAMES pages, and all listed are suggestions from fellow MARPers. FAX did take part in a previous vote, but it seems that with 17 firsts in various categories of it now, popular sentiment towards it has deteriorated since the last vote, and several players have requested it be banned, including a few of the current first place holders. Bubble Bobble and Rainbow Islands will NOT be included in this vote, as the debate continues about the secret codes in these games. Finally, in the interim since the last vote, Fast Lane has been temporarily banned, and Turbo is not yet ready to be removed from the list (still some collision detection issues)
<p>
Anyway, to the voting.
<p>
Games, then reason for potential ban:
<p>
FAX (fax, all categories)- (too easy, repetitive questions, deliberate pausing (currently 4-way tie for first in each category at maximum 85300 points))
<p>
OFF THE WALL (SENTE) (otwalls)- (too easy (currently 13-way tie for first at maximum 11 points)
<p>
Techniques, then reason for potential ban:
<p>
ROBOCOP (all versions)- Elevator point leeching (for a full description of the trick, please download Mark Longridge's hints&tricks .dat file. It basically consists of staying on an elevator at a certain spot while your score accumulates)
<p>
THE NEW ZEALAND STORY (all versions)- A warp point on 2-1 allows you to remain in one spot and wipe out enough enemies in one spot to get a bonus life before dying from timeout. Trick can potentially be used infinitely. If needed, an .inp will be posted showing this trick, or you can request it from me via e-mail (Alex Weir sent one out a number of months ago demonstarting this trick))
<p>
That's it. Happy voting.
--
qan@home.com
***NEW BANS VOTE-ALL MARPERS PLEASE RESPOND**
Moderator: Chad
-
Barry Rodewald
Ok, here goes...
FAX: If it's so easy, then how is anyone being disadvantaged if
anyone can get maximum points on it? I'll vote no, unless there is a
serious disk space issue (not likely).
<p>
OFF THE WALL: Don't know the game, can't really comment.
<p>
ROBOCOP: Yep, ban the technique. It is dead boring waiting two
minutes while your points accumulate quickly.
<p>
THE NZ STORY: Same thing, dead boring to watch. Ban it.
--
bsr@hn.pl.net
FAX: If it's so easy, then how is anyone being disadvantaged if
anyone can get maximum points on it? I'll vote no, unless there is a
serious disk space issue (not likely).
<p>
OFF THE WALL: Don't know the game, can't really comment.
<p>
ROBOCOP: Yep, ban the technique. It is dead boring waiting two
minutes while your points accumulate quickly.
<p>
THE NZ STORY: Same thing, dead boring to watch. Ban it.
--
bsr@hn.pl.net
-
Tim Morrow
My votes with some reasons follow. I sincerely hope that Bubble Bobble
& Rainbow Islands go to a vote soon too.
<p>
FAX
<p>
Don't ban the game but insist all recordings be submitted in m35tg3
which disables pausing. If people want the points they have to still
earn their stripes with the game - even if it is easy by 'most peoples
standards'. 'Too easy' is a relative term with everyone having a
different view. I'd be interested in how many people can actually get
the max score in real time.
<p>
OFF THE WALL
<p>
Don't ban the game. Insist that all games are played on the hardest
'pro' setting - this is selected at the start of the game. Define the
final score to be the difference between your score and the computer -
e.g. 11 to 3 would give a score of 8. This will spread out the current
leaders currently all on 11.
<p>
ROBOCOP (all versions) & THE NEW ZEALAND STORY (all versions).
<p>
Ban both techniques. Neither exhibits game mastery. TNZS trick can be
repeated ad nauseum - life is too short. Keep one sample inp of each
in the tricks/weird/Easter Eggs page to exhibit the leeching
techniques (and as a historical record).
--
tjmorrow@bigpond.com
& Rainbow Islands go to a vote soon too.
<p>
FAX
<p>
Don't ban the game but insist all recordings be submitted in m35tg3
which disables pausing. If people want the points they have to still
earn their stripes with the game - even if it is easy by 'most peoples
standards'. 'Too easy' is a relative term with everyone having a
different view. I'd be interested in how many people can actually get
the max score in real time.
<p>
OFF THE WALL
<p>
Don't ban the game. Insist that all games are played on the hardest
'pro' setting - this is selected at the start of the game. Define the
final score to be the difference between your score and the computer -
e.g. 11 to 3 would give a score of 8. This will spread out the current
leaders currently all on 11.
<p>
ROBOCOP (all versions) & THE NEW ZEALAND STORY (all versions).
<p>
Ban both techniques. Neither exhibits game mastery. TNZS trick can be
repeated ad nauseum - life is too short. Keep one sample inp of each
in the tricks/weird/Easter Eggs page to exhibit the leeching
techniques (and as a historical record).
--
tjmorrow@bigpond.com
-
Lord AxE
FAX > BAN
- Mapping out answers by reptitive questions
Off the Wall > Modify
- Read tim's response
Robocop > BAN
TNZS > BAN
<p>
Previous Votes
Alien Syndrome (A)> BAN
Bosconian > BAN
--
alvaromarques@hotmail.com
- Mapping out answers by reptitive questions
Off the Wall > Modify
- Read tim's response
Robocop > BAN
TNZS > BAN
<p>
Previous Votes
Alien Syndrome (A)> BAN
Bosconian > BAN
--
alvaromarques@hotmail.com
-
Alex Weir
Ehh...lets see.
FAX - never played it , but if theres a serious mis-use of the pause
button,well then I agree with Tim..i.e use of TG MAME only for this
game.
<p>
OFF THE WALL - never played it , and after having a quick look at it,
don`t particularly want to. The argument is that its` too easy ? It
isn`t really the games fault. If it`s too easy, well then it`s easy
for everyone ? Isn`t Pong a similar scenario ? I`ll abstain from this
one.
<p>
TNZS- Definitely ban this technique as it`s possible to stay alive
infinitely and amass a huge score ( I got 7m before doing
this..ZZZZZZ)
<p>
ROBOCOP- Mmm, I`m slightly biased here as I currently have the top
score on this, although let me state that I`m not worried about
losing any LB points here. My argument to keep this technique is as
follows:
1) Unlike GnG or TNZS, you can`t stay ( leech ) infinitely. You have
a time limit for each level, so basically by using this technique ,
you are utilising the time allowed to get as much score as possible.(
I think the maximum time to complete a whole game is around 45mins )
<p>
2) The technique was available in the arcades and isn`t a MAME bug
<p>
3) Some skill is involved in timing yourself to the last second,
before going on to clear the level and amassing as much score as time
will allow.
<p>
4) The current TG record ( arcade ) is 2m+ , so therefore Twin
Galaxies accept scores using this method.
<p>
And if anyone wants to see the technique done on 3 different levels (
3,4,and 6 ) and also another type of leeching ( not as much score-
wise,but still gets you an extra 120k or so ), download my 5m score
to see how it`s done.
<p>
Oh, QT, I`ll send you info on a cheat on Q-Bert which should be
definitely banned ( check your e-mail ). It`s a long explanation , so
I won`t post it here.
<p>
And that concludes the voting from the Irish Jury.........
<p>
Slan,
<p>
ALEX
--
alexweir@indigo.ie
FAX - never played it , but if theres a serious mis-use of the pause
button,well then I agree with Tim..i.e use of TG MAME only for this
game.
<p>
OFF THE WALL - never played it , and after having a quick look at it,
don`t particularly want to. The argument is that its` too easy ? It
isn`t really the games fault. If it`s too easy, well then it`s easy
for everyone ? Isn`t Pong a similar scenario ? I`ll abstain from this
one.
<p>
TNZS- Definitely ban this technique as it`s possible to stay alive
infinitely and amass a huge score ( I got 7m before doing
this..ZZZZZZ)
<p>
ROBOCOP- Mmm, I`m slightly biased here as I currently have the top
score on this, although let me state that I`m not worried about
losing any LB points here. My argument to keep this technique is as
follows:
1) Unlike GnG or TNZS, you can`t stay ( leech ) infinitely. You have
a time limit for each level, so basically by using this technique ,
you are utilising the time allowed to get as much score as possible.(
I think the maximum time to complete a whole game is around 45mins )
<p>
2) The technique was available in the arcades and isn`t a MAME bug
<p>
3) Some skill is involved in timing yourself to the last second,
before going on to clear the level and amassing as much score as time
will allow.
<p>
4) The current TG record ( arcade ) is 2m+ , so therefore Twin
Galaxies accept scores using this method.
<p>
And if anyone wants to see the technique done on 3 different levels (
3,4,and 6 ) and also another type of leeching ( not as much score-
wise,but still gets you an extra 120k or so ), download my 5m score
to see how it`s done.
<p>
Oh, QT, I`ll send you info on a cheat on Q-Bert which should be
definitely banned ( check your e-mail ). It`s a long explanation , so
I won`t post it here.
<p>
And that concludes the voting from the Irish Jury.........
<p>
Slan,
<p>
ALEX
--
alexweir@indigo.ie
-
Lord AxE
Better do this again.
<p>
FAX [BAN] - The questions come up the same way between each recording.
<p>
Off the Wall [BAN/Modify] - The top score of 11 is not that hard to
reach as 13 players have reach it.
<p>
ROBOCOP [BAN] - Complete cheese. Sitting there gaining score while
doing nothing.
<p>
TNZS [BAN] - Seems to much like Ghosts 'n Goblin. Where it take
skill to reach a point. Then doing same thing over and over again.
Gaining enough score to get a extra man then dying.
<p>
Previous Votes:
<p>
Alien Syndrom (A) [BAN] - Gaining three men for the price of one is
not good.
<p>
Bosconian/Naughty Boy/Scion [BAN] - A player should try and complete
the level at hand.
<p>
Vulgus/Roc 'n Rope [BAN] - Read TNZS.
--
alvaromarques@hotmail.com
<p>
FAX [BAN] - The questions come up the same way between each recording.
<p>
Off the Wall [BAN/Modify] - The top score of 11 is not that hard to
reach as 13 players have reach it.
<p>
ROBOCOP [BAN] - Complete cheese. Sitting there gaining score while
doing nothing.
<p>
TNZS [BAN] - Seems to much like Ghosts 'n Goblin. Where it take
skill to reach a point. Then doing same thing over and over again.
Gaining enough score to get a extra man then dying.
<p>
Previous Votes:
<p>
Alien Syndrom (A) [BAN] - Gaining three men for the price of one is
not good.
<p>
Bosconian/Naughty Boy/Scion [BAN] - A player should try and complete
the level at hand.
<p>
Vulgus/Roc 'n Rope [BAN] - Read TNZS.
--
alvaromarques@hotmail.com
-
Brian McLean
Ban, ban, ban, and ban.
<p>
Fear the righteous indignation of my elitism!
<p>
Brian McLean
--
bmclean84@hotmail.com
<p>
Fear the righteous indignation of my elitism!
<p>
Brian McLean
--
bmclean84@hotmail.com
-
Ray Atkinson
Fax: With repetitive questions, get rid of it.
Otwalls: In this game playing defense is not too hard and can be a
judge of skill. Subtract for score.
Robocop and Tzns: Stop the leeching
<p>
MARP is for showing skill, not cheese.
--
jinx@wenzmemorials.com
Otwalls: In this game playing defense is not too hard and can be a
judge of skill. Subtract for score.
Robocop and Tzns: Stop the leeching
<p>
MARP is for showing skill, not cheese.
--
jinx@wenzmemorials.com
-
Gameboy9
OK... I guess I should vote - so here we go...
<p>
FAX - too easy - throw it out.
<p>
Off The Wall - either throw it out or use the most difficult setting -
high score minus low.
<p>
Robocop and TNZS - ban it. Period.
<p>
I know... short answers
--
goldengameboy@yahoo.com
<p>
FAX - too easy - throw it out.
<p>
Off The Wall - either throw it out or use the most difficult setting -
high score minus low.
<p>
Robocop and TNZS - ban it. Period.
<p>
I know... short answers
--
goldengameboy@yahoo.com
-
Dave Kaupp
FAX: If the answers/questions are the same for each game each time,
then ban.
<p>
OTW: score minus opponent_score, or ban. Either ways OK for me. I
prefer subtracting the opponents score for most sports type games.
<p>
The rest: No leaching!
--
dave@kaupp.cx
then ban.
<p>
OTW: score minus opponent_score, or ban. Either ways OK for me. I
prefer subtracting the opponents score for most sports type games.
<p>
The rest: No leaching!
--
dave@kaupp.cx
-
Phil
To ban 2p games or broken games : ok (btw I have 2 more broken games :
dday and chplft)
<p>
I'm not so enthusiastic to ban games which are working well . I prefer
to have on marp the largest number of different games as possible
(instead of the "clones prolification")[btw the erasure of goldstar
hasn't been officially voted ... so I propose a vote in another
thread]
<p>
So here is my vote :
FAX : keep it .. but just unsplit it (1 entry is enough)
OTWALLS : keep it ... but with a "goal-average" system score (as we
should also do on all soccer games)
<p>
BANNED TECHNICS : (the only game I know is vulgus)... ban extralife
leeching for vulgus ; I will study other games later
--
plamat@club-internet.fr
dday and chplft)
<p>
I'm not so enthusiastic to ban games which are working well . I prefer
to have on marp the largest number of different games as possible
(instead of the "clones prolification")[btw the erasure of goldstar
hasn't been officially voted ... so I propose a vote in another
thread]
<p>
So here is my vote :
FAX : keep it .. but just unsplit it (1 entry is enough)
OTWALLS : keep it ... but with a "goal-average" system score (as we
should also do on all soccer games)
<p>
BANNED TECHNICS : (the only game I know is vulgus)... ban extralife
leeching for vulgus ; I will study other games later
--
plamat@club-internet.fr
-
BeeJay
FAX: don't ban - if people really want to spend the time learning
the order of the questions this is not really much different to
learning how to play say Gyruss ad infinitem. Pausing is a different
issue and I'm not sure how we approach this save for enforcing use of
a "pause-disabled" version of Mame.
<p>
OFF THE WALL - don't ban. Once again being too easy is a relative
term that is not to my mind a reason for banning - or I could argue
that Gyruss is too easy relatively speaking.
<p>
Robocop, TNZS - BAN BAN BAN.
<p>
BeeJay.
--
brianjohnstone@jade.co.nz
the order of the questions this is not really much different to
learning how to play say Gyruss ad infinitem. Pausing is a different
issue and I'm not sure how we approach this save for enforcing use of
a "pause-disabled" version of Mame.
<p>
OFF THE WALL - don't ban. Once again being too easy is a relative
term that is not to my mind a reason for banning - or I could argue
that Gyruss is too easy relatively speaking.
<p>
Robocop, TNZS - BAN BAN BAN.
<p>
BeeJay.
--
brianjohnstone@jade.co.nz
-
Ben Jos Walbeehm
The first two: Ban the games. The other two: Ban the techniques.
<p>
Cheers,
Ben Jos.
--
walbeehm@walbeehm.com
<p>
Cheers,
Ben Jos.
--
walbeehm@walbeehm.com
-
JoustGod
FAX- delete all current scores, then require all subsequent
submissions be made with the latest TG version of MAME.
<p>
Off The Wall- leave it...just another Easter egg 100-pointer for new
MARPers to find.
<p>
Robocop and TNZS...ban the techniques.
<p>
JoustGod
--
pinballwiz1@msn.com
submissions be made with the latest TG version of MAME.
<p>
Off The Wall- leave it...just another Easter egg 100-pointer for new
MARPers to find.
<p>
Robocop and TNZS...ban the techniques.
<p>
JoustGod
--
pinballwiz1@msn.com